302, (303 Withdrawn) (Michael) (failed)

[michaelenstone]

This bill is to cover the event that player need to be absent from the game.

301. Where a player notifies the other players they will be absent from the game they shall be able to instruct a proxy to vote on their behalf along with instructions on how to vote. The proxy may not vote counter to these instructions. The instructions shall be made public upon the players return. Proxies can only be nominated for defined periods of time. If a player's turn comes round before the end of their period of absence the proxy shall use a public dice roller to determine their score between -2 and 1

303. Where a player does not notify the game of their absence their votes shall be assumed to be the same as that of the player with the lowest score. Should a player be called to propose a rule in a period when another player knows the proposer is absent, that other player can declare the fact and advance play with the proposer losing point as if they lost a vote. In the event such a call proves to be erroneous the player declaring the absence shall have their score halved and the deducted points shall be awarded to the injured party. The player declared absent does not regain the points deducted as a result of losing the vote nor do they get the opportunity to propose a new rule.

[michaelenstone]

Written on my phone so poor grammar...will correct when I get home

[oafcmetty]

Don't we already have a rule which deals with absences?

[michaelenstone]

The rules as they stand mean that we have to wait 48hrs for proposals and 24hrs during a vote.  These rules add a way of allowing the game to progress without any waiting.  

Also if you are absent currently you will lose points.  These rules add a mechanism to reduce the number of point you lose by being absent.

[Neil]

Yawn

[michaelenstone]

What changes would you like to see?

[Robin_C]

I guess it's useful to be able to skip the 48hr period - maybe as simple as skipping straight to an empty, automatically-lost proposal if you delare absence - ie remove the 48hr wait for everyone else

[Neil]

I was harsh, one rule to cover voting and proposals in absence is worthwhile.  It's not worth two rules' points.

Side-point
Your proposal doesn't penalise the proxy ignoring instructions, which could be quite entertaining, although I doubt intentional.

To incentivise declaring absence, you could add a penalty to the auto-propose and auto-vote rules (i.e. if a vote is auto-cast due to time limit, the voter loses 10 pts).  I would support something along these lines as a second rule in the same proposal.

I don't think we need a complicated function for this: someone declares absence, nominates a proxy, proxy gets two votes until absentee returns.  Proposals are simply skipped (or something else quick & fun).  Simple.

[domtheseal]

I'm going to "chime in" as Neil has suggested...

I wouldn't say this is dull, instead I'd say this goes against engaged game play.  This offers a motive to be absent.  Absence, in the interest of the game, should be discouraged (as the rules do now?!)

My suggested amendment would be to penalise the absent!

[michaelenstone]

The aim of the rule is to allow people to go on holiday without incurring penalties. While I agree with the sentiment to avoid absence the reality is that people should be able to go on holiday without having to check the game every couple of days.

If you get penalised for being away it is more likely that players will just leave the game. It's unlikely that you would avoid holidays but if you lose the majority of your points you are unlikely to join back in once you return because you are so far behind.

[domtheseal]

Yes, fair point

My concern is that you've written it like a person who's about to go on holiday...anywhere nice?

I think Neil's suggestion to penalise when a player doesn't announce absence is good!

[oafcmetty]

People are allowed holidays? Madness.

[Robin_C]

Me too:

"A player can announce their absence at any time. They are considered Absent until they announce their return. During this Absence, the player is treated as if not in the game. If a player does not announce their absence, every action they miss (voting, proposing etc) carries a 10-point penalty. 

Note: other actions can affect a player's score during their absence"

[Neil]

Big improvements, propose tweaking the above, keep:

A player can announce their absence at any time. They are considered Absent until they announce their return. During this Absence, the player is treated as if not in the game.

but then...

If a player not declared absent fails to vote within a voting time limit, or fails to make any proposal within their proposal time limit; they are considered 'AWOL' until they announce their return.  AWOL players automatically miss actions (voting, proposing etc.) without the other players having to wait for the relevant windows to close.  Each missed action carries a ten-point penalty.

This way an AWOL player doesn't force everyone else to wait for their non-response on every turn.

[Robin_C]

Love it. Don't forget:

"Note: other actions can affect a player's score during their absence"

[Neil]

In which case "treated as if not in the game" is not appropriate, better to go back to Mike's earlier designs for that bit (and not add a note).

[michaelenstone]

So rule 302:

A player can announce their absence at any time. They are considered Absent until they announce their return. During this Absence, the player shall nominate a proxy, the proxy gets two votes until absentee returns.  Proposals are simply skipped. 

If a player not declared absent fails to vote within a voting time limit, or fails to make any proposal within their proposal time limit; they are considered 'AWOL' until they announce their return.  AWOL players automatically miss actions (voting, proposing etc.) without the other players having to wait for the relevant windows to close.  Each missed action carries a ten-point penalty.

[michaelenstone]

Vote has been called.  24 hours starting from now.  I have already received a couple of votes by PM and I will count these so  no need to resend

[michaelenstone]

Additional clarification:  This proposal was originally for a bill composed of two rules.  The debate has simplified this to a single rule.  As such my proposal is only for the single rule numbered 302.

[michaelenstone]

Results are in:

Me: For
Neil: For
Dom: For
Alex: Against
Robin: For
Rich: No Vote (Assumed For)

Proposal Fails.  Votes must be unanimous for the first two rounds.

[Neil]

Interesting.  Rich would now be AWOL, except we didn't enact the rule.

[Robin_C]

BANK ROBBERY!

[Neil]

Stop police

[Neil]

ha.  no votes for you.

[Robin_C]

Wrong. You is no policeman.

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